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Kfir mishap averted
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snake2
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 5 Dec 2006 13:32:15 GMT Report for Abuse
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Biggles,
Now I wonder how Migs are going to do the job? In my day, I landed my plane in a nearby field and did the business with a pistol.
Wow, are you actually Squadron Leader James Bigglesworth??;) Welcome to the forum.
The news Migs are supposed to give the SLAF better ground attack capability. Great info in this thread for Airplane and defence freaks ;)(Me included) |
snake2
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5 Dec 2006 13:42:34 GMT Report for Abuse
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Greyfox,
Since you seem to have a handle on SL naval warfare, I'd like to ask a question. How about the use of SBS personnel to conduct strikes on Sea tiger bases? I know that this could be considered as unconventional warfare, but has the use of the SBS unloading from offshore vessels not been exploited? |
Saervek
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 5 Dec 2006 14:31:49 GMT Report for Abuse
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GreyFox,
Thanks for the pics and links man.
With the OPVs, I should have been a bit clearer. It's not the size or mission of the OPVs I'm arguing about, we definitely need small/medium warships with greater endurance than the FACs to guard our waters. What I'd like to see though are some reasonably well-armed vessels, because what we have ATM are basically useless if we were ever to get into a major naval confrontation.
Your right, Sayura at least could be rearmed, from what I know, the original design (Sukanya)is based on these;
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/rok/ffk-951.htm
These general warfare frigates are more the sort of ships that I'm talking about, although we'd have a lot trouble refitting our vessel to this standard, the Indians took the discount route and didn't fit it with anything larger than a 40mm Bofors, and they wouldn't help us anyway thanks to the eelam clowns in south india. We'd then probably have to try the South Koreans for a refit, and even if they agreed we'd have to pay through the nose for the US equipment (if they agreed to sell it to us).
I like your nomination BTW (Fearless-class) especially if it could be operated in the Palk Straits without running aground/requiring half the 4th FAC Flotilla to protect it. What I was thinking of myself was something like this;
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/1166_1-specs.htm
http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/fleet/russian/surface/gepard-specs-01.gif
http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/fleet/russian/surface/gepard-specs-02.gif
They're small, well-armed and capable of fulfilling most missions. I saw somewhere that Vietnam had a 2+2 deal (2 bought, 2 built) for about 300 million. Thats about 75 mil per unit. It sounds like a hell of lot, but only till you hear that Sayura, around 10 yrs old when we bought it (and very lightly armed) cost about 20 million, and refitting the Israeli FMVs cost around 26 million. |
SenaM
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 5 Dec 2006 14:53:00 GMT Report for Abuse
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Post re- 'high' price paid for Mig 27s in the recent issue of the 'Sunday Times', is mischievous .. also poor quality journalism. Obviously inspired by an individual who thought he could 'cut' a deal with some-one in defence equipment purchasing, and supply something possibly cheaper .. yet, with what guarantees as to quality of product ?
These aircraft will have a 7 or 8 year TBO (Time Before Overhaul or Refurbishment). At the end of that period, it has to be virtually dismantled to its components, subjected to a detailed examination .. inspected for condition (viz. corrosion, wear, and other damage), and then re- built. This is very costly .. comparing to prices as they were, some years ago is not very relevant. These inspections are considered essential, and will apply even if the aircraft and engines had been 'inhibited' and the a'cft maintained under 'good' storage conditions (hangared, as against kept in the 'open'). The other aspect of course is the improved targetng capability demanded by the SLAF (for utilising precision/guided bombs) .. associated equipment packages are costly.
The MIG 27 is said to be more versatile than the Kfir C2 (and C7). According to contributor to this column MIG-29C,
it can perform very well at low-level too, in providing 'close air support' to the Army - which is what we did not have, at Muhamalai. (Not the fault of the air force .. simply, because the Army thought they could do it on their own, and did not care to 'bring-in' the air force, when they were formulating their plans). The MIG 27 can also 'do' the task performed ably by the Kfir .. that of precision bombing from high altitude.
Believe, we are getting a good product - at the current market price for this type of machine (and associated equipment package).
Edited By - SenaM - 5 Dec 2006 15:00:11 GMT |
GreyFox
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5 Dec 2006 14:58:09 GMT Report for Abuse
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Snake2
The problem is that, it is hard to accurately spot sea tiger bases by air or by sea. Their bases are small and scattered around well.
On top of that they hide their sea tiger boats about 200m inland from the coastal areas. These boats are hidden by lush green foilage.
Deploying SBS personnals to destroy sea tiger bases could cause heavy casaulties for our forces, because the LTTE terrorists will adapt to our new method and set ambushes and mines around their sea bases.
I think its better to take out spotted tiger sea bases by the SLAF jets, while the SLN continously patrols the seas with OPVs thereby resticting Sea tiger movements and their weapons flow. If this dual startegy is done long enough, it can cripple the sea tiger wing and ultimately reduce it to a shadow of its former self.
Edited By - GreyFox - 5 Dec 2006 15:42:03 GMT |
Raptor
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5 Dec 2006 15:23:30 GMT Report for Abuse
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| I guess we have to step up our Recon flights in order to locate the hidden sea tiger bases. I believe its worth invest on few more Recon air crafts. |
Su33
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 5 Dec 2006 15:28:57 GMT Report for Abuse
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I'd like to rectify some of the outdated info in this marvellous, insightful discussion taking place....
According to one of my friends - a well informed MOD of a similar web community...
1. SLN no longer has the luxury of the 2 Saar 4 FMVs. They were rendered non-operational over 3 years ago.
2. Sayura returned to India for a 'refit' months ago. The Indian navy during that time 'lent' us a similar OPV. It was this OPV that was operating during the recent hostilities (mavilaru, Muttur, Muhamalai, sampoor). However, Sayura has returned to SL with the 'refit'. I cannot elaborate on what the 'refit' was.
3. The Billion dollar deals greyfox mentions (the Vigilantes, The LLS of the Royal Auxillary, The serbian Missile frigates) too are over 2 years old. These deals never took off the ground for various reasons. For eg - the LLS was far too big to be birthed in Colombo or Kankasanthurei harbour. |
GreyFox
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5 Dec 2006 15:37:42 GMT Report for Abuse
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Saervek
You have some good choices there. Unfortunately as you yourself said, they are too expensive for our SLN to buy and build a fleet. Plus they are too expensive to operate as well.
The SLN doesn't have to worry about a major Naval confrontation because we are not fight a real blue water navy here. Frigates might prove to be too cumbersome in the current theater of war.
The SLN is looking to build a fleet of 15-20 ships that can give SLN full control of the seas. Building or buying a fleet of OPVs seems to the only thing that can give the SLN most bang for their buck.
The USA gave us a free OPV (USS courageous) because they saw that the SLN lacked the long reach needed to patrol the seas effciently. After we recieved the USS courageous, Sandagiri himself said 'This new vessel will increase our naval power by 75%'. I don't if that is totally true or not.
The fearless class vessel is only a large class patrol ship not. They are agile , look:
http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/fearless/fearless5.html
But I do hope that Lanka will buy or build OPVs that look and move similarly to the fearless class vessels, armed with a 76mm automatic cannon and perhaps a 30mm cannon at the rear of the ship.
Edited By - GreyFox - 5 Dec 2006 16:13:04 GMT |
BitterTruth
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5 Dec 2006 16:09:57 GMT Report for Abuse
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Su33:
'd like to rectify some of the outdated info in this marvellous, insightful discussion taking place....
According to one of my friends - a well informed MOD of a similar web community...
1. SLN no longer has the luxury of the 2 Saar 4 FMVs. They were rendered non-operational over 3 years ago.
2. Sayura returned to India for a 'refit' months ago. The Indian navy during that time 'lent' us a similar OPV. It was this OPV that was operating during the recent hostilities (mavilaru, Muttur, Muhamalai, sampoor). However, Sayura has returned to SL with the 'refit'. I cannot elaborate on what the 'refit' was.
3. The Billion dollar deals greyfox mentions (the Vigilantes, The LLS of the Royal Auxillary, The serbian Missile frigates) too are over 2 years old. These deals never took off the ground for various reasons. For eg - the LLS was far too big to be birthed in Colombo or Kankasanthurei harbour.
Me owa kiyala ape athal kadanna epa.
Don't ruin our fun! |
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