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Kfir mishap averted
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eskimo06
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Joined: Mar 2006
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LK Information  28 Sep 2006 15:05:17 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mig-29C ... thank you once again for the interesting information you have been providing this forum.

No doubt JF-17 or JF-17 Thunder looks interesting especially in terms SLAF's cost and tactical and strategic needs. Looks like the Aircraft is still in the development stage. When is this Aircraft ready for delivery? I Hope the SLAF had genuinely expressed interest in purchasing the JF-17 from Pakistan. What type electronics and weapons systems is use by the JF-17. I'm not sure about the capabilities of these, but look like they are fitted with the infra-red search-and-track systems, night-vision goggle capability and a digital dual Fly by wire (FBW).

Do you think with your expertise knowledge in Aircraft JF-17 is the best Aircraft out there for SLAF's strategic needs? If not which Aircraft do you recommend for SLAF's needs to use along with their existing Kfir C.7 and the Mig-27's.
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 543
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 08:58:29 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mr. eskimo06

Sorry I've taken this long to reply.. now to answer your questions:

Looks like the Aircraft is still in the development stage. When is this Aircraft ready for delivery?


The aircraft will most likely be available for export towards the middle/late of 2008.. If the SLAF decides to acquire this aircraft, it will most probably be around the middle/late of 2009.

I Hope the SLAF had genuinely expressed interest in purchasing the JF-17 from Pakistan.


I believe the SLAF has signed a memorandum or understanding between CAC and PAIC for 6 aircraft .. however this is not a definitive contract .. I guess more will be know by the end of 2007.

What type electronics and weapons systems is use by the JF-17. I'm not sure about the capabilities of these, but look like they are fitted with the infra-red search-and-track systems, night-vision goggle capability and a digital dual Fly by wire (FBW).


The spec will be very similar to the Pakistani built export variant. The information is available on the internet.

Do you think with your expertise knowledge in Aircraft JF-17 is the best Aircraft out there for SLAF's strategic needs? If not which Aircraft do you recommend for SLAF's needs to use along with their existing Kfir C.7 and the Mig-27's.


The main aim of the SLAF in the near future should be to minimise the number of different aircraft types used .. the current mix of Kfir C.2/C.7's, Mig-27M's and F-7's is a maintenance nightmare for such a small air arm and is extremely poor management of its engineering resources .. they should aim to consolidate on one specific multi-role variant and thus substantially enhance the effectiveness of the SLAF..

The reason this aircraft is the best suited for the SLAF is based on current the geo-strategic balance within the region/maintenance and training considerations/4th generation capability.

The current mix of aircraft within the SLAF has the necessary capability for the time being to tackle the Thamil Tigers consistently and effectively. However if this conflict was to continue for the next 5-10 years, then towards 2010 or sooner, bearing in mind the current escalation of technology within the conflict, these aircraft cannot be counted to provide the edge currently enjoyed by the SLAF. As a result the SLAF will have to look at modernising its fleet.

This will mainly mean phasing out the F-7 and Kfir C.2/C.7's .. The MiG-27M's I believe should be retained till around 2015. The aircraft is still a very capable platform with plenty of fatigue life left in the airframe and ideally suited for the ground attack role. With a comprehensive modernisation plan for its offensive and defensive systems the aircraft should turn out to be a good work horse for the SLAF.

The JF-17 has the required level of 4th generation technology present to effectively combat any improved aerial threat the Thamil Tigers can throw at the SLAF, including possible 3rd generation MANPAD threats. The aircraft will have the ability to use western avionics and a wide variety of western weaponary in addition to Chinese systems. The main advantage offered is with respect to training and maintenance. It would appear that diplomatic relations between Sri Lanka and China, and Pakistan, will improve and get stronger with time. This potentially offers the SLAF the benefit of a reliable, stable and continuous platform with which it can enhance its engineering and training capabilities.

The K-8 currently in the SLAF providing advanced jet training will be ideally suited for training any future JF-17 pilots.

Coming back to today, the SLAF has proved to be instrumental and its eerie how my predictions are coming true ..

The desperation of the Thamil Tigers is highlighted by 2 very high profile failed attempts in 2 months to acquire MANPAD's and other weaponary in the international market.. suffice to say these arrests and its implications about the genuineness of the Thamil Tiger leader to a negotiated settlement to the conflict in Sri Lanka has not gone unnoticed within the US establishment .. there will be repercussions for this belligerent behaviour.

I believe the Thamil Tiger leader is to make his annual speech in about 7 weeks .. am I correct?? This would imply that he has 7 weeks to engineer and achieve a substantial military victory to turn around the current rut his organisation is in and most notably such a victory is essential to woo the flagging desponded hard core masses supporting his organisation around the world.. as is evident from postings within this forum.

Another interesting fact I couldn't help but observe .. the Thamil Tigers re-emerged quite dramatically within seven months after the Sri Lankan military re-captured the Jaffna peninsula in 1995. In 1995 the Thamil Tigers were at full strength blasting out on all cylinders .. in 2006 the Thamil Tigers eastern wing is seriously compromised and in disarray / morale has suffered and quite a considerable number of causalities are in hospitals within rebel territory .. and the organization has 7 weeks.

Very interesting I would say.. lets see what happens..
Edited By - Mig-29C - 2 Oct 2006 09:01:05 GMT
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 10:21:19 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Good Morning to the Sri Lankan's

I can inform the Forum that the Stinger system sought by the Thamil Tigers in the recent Guam sting were infact FIM-92D's.

The FIM-92D utilises a two-band (IR/UV) optical seeker that allows it to distinguish more efficiently between the real target and IR decoys or background clutter.

This stinger variant is very similar in performance to the SA-18, and the operator will subjected to the same limitations I highlighted on page 1 in the following thread.
KfirC2
Joined: Sep 2006
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 10:30:06 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Hi Mig-29C

Do you have any information about SAMs LTTE already has, have they failed to accquire any recently?

We are still awaiting any news on new fighter for SLAF, any hint?

Is it true SLAF is to get a new batch of kfirs?
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 10:47:46 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mr. KfirC2

Do you have any information about SAMs LTTE already has, have they failed to accquire any recently?


The LTTE has thus far used SA-7, SA-14, FIM-92A and HN-5 missiles in its military operations against the SLAF.

I have been informed that the LTTE did receive some stocks of SA-7's between 2003 and 2004.

We are still awaiting any news on new fighter for SLAF, any hint?


I did not infer that this aircraft was a fighter :o) .. what I said was:

''There will be new aircraft entering SLAF service within the coming months''

Just be patient sir :o) ..

Is it true SLAF is to get a new batch of kfirs?


There is a provisional agreement to provide 2 x C.7s to the SLAF if it was to lose any of its remaining Kfirs. However it would have to lose Kfirs in combat or due to attrition for this agreement to take effect.

Hope this helps..
Edited By - Mig-29C - 2 Oct 2006 11:22:28 GMT
KfirC2
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 10:59:01 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Hi Mig-29C

To your knowledge, how far have they been sucessfull in bringing SLAF planes using each of these specific missiles?

I am running inpatient :-)
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 11:37:50 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mr KfirC2..

Here is a list of verified SLAF casualties as a result of LTTE MANPAD action:

- 29 April 1995: HS.748 Srs.2A shot down by SA-7.

- 29 April 1995: HS.748 Srs.2A shot down by SA-7.

- 14 July 1995: IA.58A Pucara shot down by SA-7.

- 19 March 1996: Mi-24 shot down by LTTE SA-7.

- 10 November 1997: Mi-24 shot down by SA-14.

- 17 December 1999: Mi-24 shot down by SA-14.

- 24 May 2000: Mi-24 shot down by SA-14.

- 30 March 2000: An-32 shot down by FIM-92A.

- 23 October 2000: Mi-24 shot down by FIM-92A.

Thus far the LTTE has only successfully targeted SLAF transports and SLAF helicopters. All missiles fired by the LTTE at SLAF fast jets thus far have failed. The following list contains the missile types fired at SLAF fast jets:

- FIM-92A at a Kfir C.2 on the 20 Aug 1997 - missed

- SA-14 at a Kfir C.2 on the 13 Aug 1998 - missed

- FIM-92A at MiG-27M's on 3 different occasions between Aug 2000 and Aug 2001 - missed

Hope this helps..
Edited By - Mig-29C - 2 Oct 2006 16:20:06 GMT
KfirC2
Joined: Sep 2006
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 11:47:48 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Thanks

There is a provisional agreement to provide 2 x C.7s to the SLAF if it was to lose any of its remaining Kfirs. However it would have to lose Kfirs in combat or due to attrition for this agreement to take effect.


Is this because SLAF lacks sufficient funding or IAI don't want to sell Kfirs to SLAF?
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 543
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LK Information  2 Oct 2006 13:03:47 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mr KfirC2

Is this because SLAF lacks sufficient funding or IAI don't want to sell Kfirs to SLAF?


The SLAF has sufficient strike aircraft at this moment in time for its offensive/defensive air operations, as a result additional Kfir C.7's are not really required unless new operational/tactical requirements warrant the need for additional aircraft..

The IAI has never disallowed or denied the transfer of Kfir aircraft to the SLAF.
Mig-29C
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 543
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LK Information  3 Oct 2006 07:11:05 GMT  Report for Abuse  
Mr KfirC2

You seem quite interested in your countries airforce.. i have created the following thread:

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?p=1012999#post1012999


you might want to check it out to see what the SLAF currently uses .. hope you like it :o)
Edited By - Mig-29C - 3 Oct 2006 07:19:05 GMT
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